Banish Burnout By Untangling Negative Behavior Patterns With Janice Litvin

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What does it take to banish burnout? Tony Martignetti talks with Janice Litvin, award-winning speaker, certified virtual presenter and author of Banish Burnout Toolkit, as she dishes out on the different factors that contribute to burnout and how we, as human beings, can combat its effect on us. Janice talks about her past, dealing with her own experiences fighting the people that caused burnout and discovering that managing it is a work in progress every one of us is capable of doing.

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Banish Burnout By Untangling Negative Behavior Patterns With Janice Litvin

It is my honor to introduce you to my guest, Janice Litvin. She is on a mission to help leaders and teams banish burnout in their organizations so their employees can come to work healthy, happy and ready to work. She does this through her keynotes, workshops and accountability groups. Her new book Banish Burnout Toolkit takes teams through the journey of untangling their negative behavior patterns to effect real behavior change for life. What makes Janice unique is her twenty years of technology recruiting experience, ten years of IT experience, her study of Psychology and her experience changing her behaviors. Isn’t that always the way? She lives in San Francisco Bay Area with her husband who is a tech recruiter as well and her son who is wise beyond his years. I am thrilled to welcome you to the show, Janice.

Thank you for having me, Tony. I’m delighted to be here.

I’m looking forward to digging into your story to find out more. We have many things to talk about around burnout. This is a topic that is close to everyone’s hearts these days. That’s part of your story and we will get into that. I want to first explain a bit about how we roll on the show so you understand. We are going to have you share your story but we are going to do it through flashpoints. These are points in your story that have ignited your gifts into the world. As you are sharing your story, we are going to stop along the way and see what’s showing up. Janice, I’m going to hand it over to you and see what’s on your mind.

There are so many stories to tell. I will try to start with a quick vignette. I heard someone says that because of the abuse they received in their childhood, that gave them the gift of being able to help others. Through the process of writing my book, I began to realize a lot about my upbringing brought me to the place that I was able to help other people because of overcoming a lot of different obstacles. In my ‘80s I did go to therapy. I went to a union therapist which was immensely helpful. You peel back all kinds of layers of the onion.

There are underlying, limiting beliefs that sometimes don’t get addressed. They show up as different fears, like fears to get on the phone with an executive, do presentations, make sales calls and a lot of these fears come from passive messages. For example, you come home from school with a 93. The parent says, What happened to the other seven points? How about celebrating the 93? Does that take a lot of work and energy? When you have parents that are critical with very demanding expectations and criticism, the child feels unsure of themselves, loses confidence and doesn’t build strong self-esteem as one would hope.

Thinking about that story in its own right. My son is very much in that mode of, not that we criticize him but his self-criticism of that 93. It’s crazy to think that people can’t get into the feeling of, “Look how far I have come,” instead of, “How much do I have to go?” The gap versus the gain. Would you say that the burnout comes from this feeling like,I still have too far to go? I have to keep on working hard to get there?” That was the element that you are speaking to.

Burnout comes from a lot of different places. In terms of the corporate workforce or any size workforce, a manager that’s too demanding can reconnect some of those old flames of self-doubt. Too much work, lack of control and emotional intelligence. When I talk about lack of control, I can bring that with the COVID. A lot of people are more stressed and more burned out than ever before. We have no control over what’s happening. We can’t go out and see our friends like we used to.

If you don’t go for your dreams, there’s no one to answer to but yourself.

We can’t go to parties. We can’t go to the theater because it’s closed. The restaurants are closed. You have to grab your food and bring it home or maybe sit outside, which is fine except if you live in Chicago, Boston or New York. You can’t sit outside. A lot of us are experiencing the stress of not being able to be together. We are having birthday parties, weddings and sadly, funerals on Zoom. It’s a very strange new world and nothing that any of us could ever have imagined happened. That loss of control is extremely stressful. Everybody has different ways of reacting to it. We are all very burned out.

It’s this element of control and fears. You talked about fear earlier which is the two elements that seem to go hand in hand is wanting to control and then trying to manage fear. I want to take us back into the story of when you think about your childhood and the person you were in your developmental stages, what was it about you that got you thinking about ways of shaping people and thinking about burnout? How was it that you were in your childhood?

I grew up as a pretty happy person. There was a lot of laughter in our family and love. I grew up in a traditional Jewish home where my father came home for dinner at the same time, every single night. Every single Sunday, he took us to Sunday school, picked us up, took us for some fun horseback riding or bowling. We knew we had a strong, loving home. Your parents are your guides. They provide unconditional love. For a child, we look up to them, trust them, know that they have our best interest at heart.

A lot of parents from that generation, from the parents of the Baby Boomers, grew up where their parents were from somewhere, in my case, Eastern Europe or whatever country. They lived through the depression. Spare the rod, spoil the child. We’ve got spanked. We had very strict rules in our house. Homework and education were very important. This idea of perfection permeated. My mother was a perfectionist. Her father was a perfectionist and was very demanding. He escaped the Cossacks in Russia. This is a story that permeated our lives. In my mother’s opinion, if you didn’t work hard, you didn’t earn your accomplishment. One of the ways that have impacted my life is that I feel like if I’m not struggling, then I’m not accomplishing or deserving the things I get. In many ways, that has impeded my progress. I have needed to get some coaching in terms of my business and my own limiting beliefs to help me overcome some of those issues.

VCP 107 | Banishing BurnoutThere’s something about that, that your worth is caught up in the struggle. When you think about the prior generations, they ingrain that in us, this element of work hard. That’s what will give you what you need. That’s how you get ahead. We have started to flip the switch and say, “There’s a different way of getting that done.” It’s not about the struggle. It’s about working smarter. It’s about figuring out how to create things together, work together and find ways to work smarter. What continued to happen? As you move down your path, what did you study in school? What did you decide to pursue?

My mother who was a recruiter in Houston in the oil and gas era which is hundreds of years, said to me, “You have to major in Technical Skill because a woman in tech will always be able to find a job. I went to the University of Texas. I was one of the very few women that majored in Math. She’s right. The moment I went job hunting, I had a job offer in three days working as a computer programmer at Bank of America. I love my coworker but the problem is that I didn’t love Computer Programming. I love the people. I figured out that software training, software consulting and anything where people were involved, would be a better fit for me.

My story is around while many adults always point you in the right direction, they think they are doing the right thing by giving you this guidance like, “Go find a job that will pay the bills and give you a long life of great returns, but it’s not what you want. You are a square peg in the round hole. There was light because you are able to see this element that you did like. How long did you last before you said, I have had enough?

I worked there for four years. There were a few different things I wanted to do. One of which was to become a professional dancer. A nice Jewish girl does not become a professional dancer. I took ballet my whole life. When I was in high school my parents said, “Don’t you want to develop your friendships, have fun and work on your schoolwork? I always said the same thing, “Not really,” but I did. When I moved to San Francisco, I continued to take dance classes with the incomparable Edmark. He was a man who danced to the beat of his drum figuratively and literally. I learned a lot from that experience.

One thing I learned is that, “If you don’t go for your dreams, you have no one to answer to but yourself.” After four years working at Bank of America, a number of my dance friends were moving to Los Angeles because that’s where all the dance jobs were other than New York. I packed up, called my parents and said, I’m quitting. I’m going to become a starving artist.” When I’ve got my first gig, dancing in Reno, not topless and I will never forget this phone conversation my father said to me, “You owe it to me to live a normal life.

Luckily, I had a sense of humor. I was able to laugh. My mother smartly said, Do you want to send me your contract so I can look it over for you? To make a long story short, I did go to Reno, danced there for several months and had a wonderful time. I made the same money dancing in Reno. I made $300 a week. At that time, that was about the amount I made as a computer programmer. I find that very funny.

There’s no better definition of what we call a flashpoint than that. Telling yourself like, I want to be in line with what I feel in my heart that I want to do. I want to create and dance. I’m sure there was an emotional element to this that was underlying like, “What if I fail? What if it doesn’t work out?

It’s important to surround yourself with people who can really support you, not people who can drag you down.

That conversation happened a lot from their end down in Texas. I never looked at it that way. I knew it was a big struggle because, at that time, a lot of the variety of TV shows that hired a lot of dancers had all ended. There weren’t very many jobs. I will never forget my older brother, Don Corleone or the lawyer in the family, the consigliere. He called me one day and he said, “Let’s work this out. He’s very analytical. He’s a lawyer. He said, What would you think about giving yourself a time limit of two years? He came up with some magic number. It’s sure enough, after two years of working at Bob’s Big Boy to make extra money and typing as a temp. I met a lot of interesting actors and people, I decided it was time to come back. I went to work for a company called Computer Sciences Corporation doing software consulting and training. The training part and the consulting were up to my alley because it was all about working with people.

I met the most wonderful boss at that job which I’m still friends with. He groomed me to think for myself in business. Every time I had a problem with a client. I would go into his office, describe the problem and instead of him giving me the solution, he would say, “What do you think is the solution to this problem? I would lay out my ideas. He would say, “That sounds perfect. Don’t forget to include this. That might have been the bigger part of the answer but he groomed me to feel that I knew how to figure out answers for myself. That was hugely valuable at that time.

He treats you like a human instead of saying like, “That’s wrong. Are you missing this? Go fix it. It’s like taking your idea and building it. It is almost like an improved type of mentality. I just love the way that your story has started to evolve from this place of like, “Nothing’s perfect. Nothing’s set in stone you are just willing to be open to whatever shows up. Not holding yourself back into, “This is the way it should be. I have to follow this. Stay in tech. Stay in this.” There’s nothing wrong with being in tech.

A few years later, I started my own software consulting and training firm when the IBM PC first came out. Everybody in Corporate America had this gray box on their desk called the IBM PC with 5.25-inch floppy disks but nobody knew what to do with it. They didn’t know how to turn it on or afraid to turn it on. They didn’t know what the heck to do. I figured out that maybe I should do software training. This is before Windows. People had to learn MS-DOS commands, copy, delete, start, whatever it was. I tried a lot of people on what a PC was. We would play games and I would give everyone a part of the computer. I would have people move through the room so they could understand how data move from one place to another and how you could communicate.

VCP 107 | Banishing Burnout


After several years, everybody had training and companies were using their trainers. That same boss from Computer Sciences Corporation called me up in the late ‘80s and said to me, “Can you find me a DB2, DBA?” DB2 was new mainframe software and the DBA database role was new. The interesting part of that story is, I never planned to be a recruiter. My mother had been a recruiter. It wasn’t anything that she thought would be a good idea for me. This is before the internet. I had to place an ad in the San Francisco Examiner. A three-line ad cost me $700, which I had to dig deep to come up with. I placed the ad. I found someone. I’ve got twenty letters and one guy fit. Place the guy and I thought, I’m a recruiter.” For twenty years, I went on my merry way doing recruiting and loved it.

At the center of all this is your love of people and seeing people and you understand how people’s life couldn’t be better than it is. Not being held down to anyone’s definition of what life is. You’ve got that ingrained in you early that, I’m not going to set limitations. Other people shouldn’t either on themselves.” Part of this is where we are headed, which is when you do put yourself in boxes and when you limit yourself, what is the outcome of that? Burnout is part of that. If you hold yourself back from who you are meant to be and then you start to build pressure.

The word control comes to mind when you talk about that. When you are in that box, there’s pressure to break out either passively or not passively.

What happens next? Here you are, living a life that you like. There’s nothing to fix. What led you to do the work in the burnout space?

Talking about control in 2008. I’m sure you and everybody else will remember. We had a horrible recession. I was ready for a change. I loved recruiting but I was ready to do something else. I had no idea what to do. When you are in the thick of it, it’s hard to see the forest for the trees. There was no job and recruiting. I did what any smart person does. I went to the gym because I had gotten sedentary and I needed to lose some weight and get healthy. I played a trick on myself. I dropped my son at school, at that time he was in high school and went straight to the gym. I knew if I didn’t go straight there, I would find excuses not to get there. Thankfully my husband was working so I had that luxury. I found Zumba fitness and became a Zumba fitness instructor in 2009. Still teaching Zumba to this day but via Zoom. I taught Zumba for a couple of years. After a couple of years, I thought to myself, “There are more to life than teaching Zumba. While I loved it, I needed a mental challenge.

I wasn’t quite sure how to bring Zumba to the corporate world in terms of helping people get fit, not from doing the exercise but helping them find what we call intrinsic motivation. There’s an area of International Zumba presenter at the time named Pepper Von in Sacramento. I took him to lunch and I said, “What can I do to up my game and help people in a bigger way?” He said to me, “What is one thing that you have not done in your life that you still want to do?” The answer popped out of my head, I want to be a professional speaker.” He said, I think you have your answer.” Strangely, you have to ask somebody else what is in your head to help you dig out what’s in your head. That was the end of the conversation. I’m like, I’m ready.

I went back and I joined Toastmasters. At the same time, I did some research and I found the world of Workplace Wellness. I went back to school to study Exercise Science and Primarily Psychology. I liked the people’s side of it. I finished that program. I joined National Speakers Association and went through the academy to learn the business side of speaking as well as to tweak my speaking skills. At first, I was doing presentations about healthy eating, fitness, heart health and generic wellness, how to amp up your engagement in your wellness programs.

One day, a client called me up and said, “We want you to do a program about stress but we don’t want it to be the typical stress management mindfulness program. We want you to go deep. I’m like, “Are you sure? I can go deep. I had done a lot of work on myself. I had some research on some books about Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. I developed this program and I called it Banish Burnout right away. It was about how to dig deep and find out what your typical reactions to stress are and how to change them. How to change your negative mindset and how to change your whole outlook that you can be happier?

The way you present yourself is not somebody who is coming from a scientific way as an insult. You are coming with an approachable approach to these psychological concepts. You are packaging it in a way that people can relate to and understand. That’s the beauty of being the person you are, bringing the messages that you are bringing. When you said that it had to take somebody else to tell you, that’s oftentimes how it works. We don’t see the thing that we were good at because we were swimming in it. We are the fish swimming in the water. That’s such an interesting thing to know that this person saw you when they said, “You should do this.

We get stuck in our heads and we set up our roadblocks sometimes, our obstacles. When my son was about ten, he said to me, Mom, you get angry and then you complain about it for days. Why do you do that?” Interestingly, it took someone in the family. When a child says something like that, you are going to pay attention. That was part of the beginning of my journey that led me to where I am now is understanding that I needed to change something about me that was causing me to always be negative, critical, angry. From my work on myself, I realized that my mother, I love her very much and she was a great force in my life, very positive and supportive, was also critical and perfectionist. I realized that a lot of the criticisms caused me a lot of self-doubts and fear. The role modeling of her behavior was negative and critical. Not always but in many cases.

The key here is that environment that you are around has a big impact on who you are, how you develop in those earlier days. This is why I love doing the show. The way I have done it with people who have been on is this having people look back and say, “What has got me here? What made me into who I am? What has made me show up the way I am now?” A lot of it has to do with going back and saying, I had to face some of those things that shaped me. I had to change or use that as a power to move forward.

VCP 107 | Banishing Burnout


I realized that I would take things way too personally. When someone would critique something, I would get upset and defensive. I realized one day, I don’t want to live like this anymore. I don’t want to be angry, negative, critical of other people and critical of myself. I went through my process to understand myself better. That is what is documented in my book.

Let’s talk about your book a little more. What was driving you to write the book? Was it that the time came and you said, I have to write it, or what was pulling you towards writing the book?

When I did that first program for that first client that said, “We want to stress program and we want you to go deep. I realized the most impact comes when people do something not just sit and listen to a speaker. I created breakout exercises. To have breakout exercises, I needed a handout. I wrote a handout. After that, every time I did this program, I kept embellishing the handout. Finally, I said to myself, “To give the background, I should make it a book.” Everyone in my business coaching realm said, “You should write a book. That gives you more credibility, get your word out there. It’s a way to get your content out there.” Here’s another fun story.

The reason I told you to bring up my son, I was writing a book about Generic Workplace Wellness and how to engage people more by having the five tenets of wellness, etc. I wasn’t that excited and inspired about the book. It was never getting finished. I always had a procrastination excuse for not finishing it. One day, I was talking to my son one day who was then 26 in December of 2019. He was helping me with some social media and some marketing. He said, Mom, why aren’t you writing a book called Banish Burnout?

It took somebody else to feed me what I needed to hear. My ideas had to come from someone else. I was like, “That’s the most brilliant thing anyone’s ever said to me besides, ‘What do you want to do with your life?’ I called my editor and I said, “We are changing gears. I took the transcript of my speech and some chapters I had written about mental health. I stirred them up in the washing machine, put them through the roller and came up with this plan to write my book which is 6 tools or 6 chapters about how to banish burnout.

There’s a lesson in this. Sometimes we make it a lot more complicated than it needs to be. If we just step back and have some conversations with people, get other people’s perspectives on things. Selectively, you don’t want to be taking everyone’s feedback and be like, “Where am I making it harder than it needs to be?” Move forward then.

That’s the last tool in the toolkit which is getting an accountability buddy. It is important to handpick people around you. Surround yourself with the people that can support you, not people that can drag you down. People that understand when you want to set limitations and boundaries. In the book, I even tell people how to select an accountability buddy. If it’s somebody that’s a mentor that you are unsure of, how to write them an email and maybe you have different accountability buddies at different times of your journey. Maybe somebody only has a month to spare but there’s somebody you want to work with, then you work with them. You respect their time. You use the time together to get the help you need. Sometimes it’s brainstorming, difficult conversations or how to ask for a raise.

Doing it alone only leads to more frustration, more burnout. The result will not be as strong and powerful as having some people who you trust along for the journey.

They give you a perspective that you badly need.

I am grateful. Everything you have shared, the stories which were so colorful and the insights. I would love to know, what are the big lessons that you have learned along your journey about yourself that you want to share with people?

There’s a chapter in the book called, Unpack Your Emotional Baggage. I had been to therapy with a Union therapist and I thought, “All my baggage is unpacked.” What I was lacking was confidence. Here I was doing public speaking, getting paid to speak, working on a book. There were still areas of my life that I didn’t have 100% confidence in. For example, my mother always dwelled on people from fancy schools, Harvard, Stanford, Princeton and Yale. Every time I was going to call somebody to pitch my business if they had been to a fancy school, I didn’t call them because I thought, “They are smarter than me. Their GPA was 4.0 or 4.5. I don’t have the intelligence to speak to them.” I realized that I kept hitting my head against a wall in this particular situation and other similar situations.

VCP 107 | Banishing Burnout


I sought out the help of a coach who does NLP for those who don’t know Neuro-Linguistic Programming to help me get deep into why I was setting this roadblock for myself and help me see clear past the fact that that person is smart in their topic, which might be Math, Science or leadership but they are not an expert in burnout. That’s where I have the expertise. It was hard to get to that realization but I finally did.

It’s a reminder that we need it all the time. There are many people out there who are touting their intelligence and perfectionism or whatever it is that they have. It’s easy to feel small in many ways. We have to always remind ourselves about our greatness. We all have brilliance inside of us.

I strongly believe that textbooks-smart are not the only smart. A lot of people in Corporate America are promoted for technical skills and need emotional intelligence. In some ways, that can be taught. That should be a key prerequisite before someone is promoted.

To shift gears to one more thing about this. We have one last thing insight from you around burnout. What would you like to share with people that are reading? If they are on the verge of burnout or they are getting close to burnout, what would you like to share that’s a little nugget for them to feel a little shift in themselves?

The first thing is, you are in charge of your mental health. I’m not a Psychologist or a Psychiatrist. I’m not talking about clinical depression, which I’m aware is a clearly defined biochemical imbalance in the brain. I’m talking about people who walk around complaining negatively and don’t do anything about it. You are in charge of your life and mental life that only you can change. The first step is the awareness that you want to change and not always have this attitude of, “Someone else is in control. When my boss promotes me, then I will be happy. I have to wait to see what’s going to happen with my job before I can make plans. No, you are in charge. You can change your life.

The very first tool in my Banish Burnout Toolkit is called Stop and Audit. The first thing is becoming aware of your thoughts, behavior, patterns and whether you have an open mindset or a closed mindset. What I mean by that is, a lot of us learned our behavior from the role modeling of our parents. The first is becoming aware of your behavior and then choosing at the height of a crisis or a stressful situation to stop, take a deep cleansing breath, observe your behavior and then proceed. STOP is an acronym that came from Jon Kabat-Zinn. The father of current-day Mindfulness. He taught that STOP process. I added to the observed piece a stress audit which is to take you through the steps of how you react physically, verbally, emotionally, how upset you get and what addictive behavior you engage in.

When you write with a pen and paper, the brain talks to the hand and the hand talks to the paper. When you are dumping on paper, that’s the fear center of the brain when you go back and re-read what you have written. You have engaged the prefrontal cortex, the executive functioning part of the brain, you can see a pattern in your behavior when you let other people upset you to the point that lessens your abilities, your faith in yourself or your self-confidence. That is where you learn to change is learning how those patterns got established.

It’s easy to feel small in many ways. We always have to remind ourselves about our greatness and the brilliance inside of us.

I'm going to make sure I commit that one. I'm going to need that going forward. It made me think of this. People will get into the victim mindset versus a victor mindset. When you walk around like, “The world has done this to me, but instead when you flip the switch you say, I’m in more control than I know. I’m the one who’s driving.I have one last question for you. This is the one I asked everybody who comes on the show. What’s one book or book that has had an impact on you and why?

This book is on my son’s bookshelf. It is How to Win Friends & Influence People. My son and I are very similar in a lot of ways. One is we weren’t always students. I had to work my butt off just to get B’s. I graduated with B’s in high school and college. What I have learned about myself and my son is that we have a huge degree of Emotional Intelligence. I can look at somebody and tell a lot about a human being by their eyes, smile and body language. I will never forget when I was a little girl, my mother took me and my sister to New York. She was a night owl. We went out at 9:00 at night, walking up and down the street, then stopped for a drink. When I say drink, I mean water or soda. I don’t mean an alcoholic drink.

She would tell me, “Look at the face of the people you are passing, look at their eyes, look at their body language.” What an interesting lesson she taught me as a child, I taught my son too when he was a little boy, that when he went to events to go up to the parents of his friends, look them in the eye and say, Good morning, Mr. Jones. How are you doing today?” Everyone would come up to me and said, “You have the politest child of anybody.” He didn’t have that necessarily the textbook smarts but he had a huge degree of Emotional Intelligence, which is serving him and is serving me.

I thought about this coming from Judith Glaser who says, “Everything happens through conversation,” from her book Conversational Intelligence, “If you can master the art of having good conversations, good connections with people can take you very far.” Having emotional intelligence is a big part of that. I can’t thank you enough for coming to the show. This has been powerful. We have left many great insights and tools for people to work with. People should run out and buy your book. That’s given. Where else can people find out more about you?

Thank you for inviting me to be on your show. You are a master interviewer, very unusual and unique. I like that about you. My website is JaniceLitvin.com and my email is Janice@JaniceLitvin.com. I’m very active on LinkedIn. I love to meet new people. Connect with me and let me know how you found me.

Thank you readers for coming on the journey with us. I hope this has had an impact on you. Let us know how we can help you further.

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About Janice Litvin

VCP 107 | Banishing Burnout

Janice Litvin is on a mission to help leaders and teams banish burnout in their organizations. She does this through keynote speeches, workshops, and accountability groups.

As an award-winning speaker, certified virtual presenter, and official SHRM Recertification Provider, she wants to help as many people as possible take care of their physical and mental health, including teaching them to manage stress to prevent burnout, fall in love with fitness, and eat healthier. In these ways, she is helping people change their lives. She has developed unique strategies to maximize engagement in workplace wellness and has also developed a stress management methodology available through her workbook, Banish Burnout Toolkit™.

What makes Janice unique is that in addition to 20 years as a technology recruiter, 10 years of IT experience, and her studies of psychology, she has overcome all the challenges she talks about in her presentations. She went from being overweight and sedentary with a critical, negative attitude to a lighter, fitter, happier person who now teaches Zumba Fitness and leads stress management and healthy eating workshops and accountability groups. She is certified by the Aerobics and Fitness Association of America.

After forming Micro Search in 1983 to help clients learn how to manage their business using a desktop computer, she became a human resource executive technology recruiter in response to her Fortune 500 clients’ needs for technology talent. Over the next twenty years, clients included Charles Schwab, Oracle, The Gap, Computer Partners, Network Appliance, QuinStreet, Symantec, Vodafone, Chiron, TheraSense, Nokia, Borland, United States Army, Pacific Gas & Electric and Pacific Bell.

Janice has served on the Workplace Wellness Committee of the American Heart Association and spoken on their behalf to San Francisco Bay Area organizations. She is a professional member of the National Speakers Association, WELCOA (Wellness Council of America), and SHRM Northern California (Society for Human Resource Management). In 2017 she formed the Bay Area Wellness Association.

In addition to SHRM Nor Cal, Janice has worked with a range of other clients to present wellness workshops and programs, including PIHRA (Professionals in Human Resources Association), CAL SAE (California Society of Association Executives), Coral Reef Alliance, San Mateo Unified High School District, WellRight, Minnesota State SHRM Council, NCHRA (Next Concept Human Resources Association), First Republic Bank, Robert Half, Cities of Walnut Creek and Sunnyvale, and US HHS.

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