Bringing Inspiration As A Business Coach With Townsend Wardlaw


The assistance of a business coach is essential in every entrepreneur's strategic planning. But this collaboration must always target the thinking and mindset, too, in order to succeed and yield proper results. Tony Martignetti talks to transformational coach Townsend Wardlaw to share his work with founders and startup businesses in unlocking their full potential and forging their own meaning of success. Townsend talks about his shift from focusing on tangible sales consulting to a more meaningful business coaching. He explains how he finds inspiration from the people he coaches much more than he provides inspiration to them.


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Bringing Inspiration As A Business Coach With Townsend Wardlaw

It’s my honor to introduce you to my guest, Townsend Wardlaw. He is a transformational coach. He has a passion for serving founders and leaders at early-stage companies. In the last several years, he's focused on sales consulting, focusing on people processing tools in that process. He enables these companies to grow and scale to move towards a potential exit. He's worked with hundreds of companies in his journey. Dozens of them have gone to liquidity. He shifted his focus lately on what is going on between the ears of these founders. He lives currently in Denver, at least for the next few weeks, where he's going to be making a mobile move to become a nomad. He lives with his wife and his dog, Jax. Welcome to the show, Townsend.

Thanks, Tony. I’m glad to be here.

We're thrilled to hear your story. I'm loving where you are now and where you're headed.

I'm hitting the road.

On the road, which is always exciting in this day and age when people have this anxiousness to get out and move.

We were sitting here and my wife is also a coach and a consultant. I've been working largely virtually for the last several years. When I added it up one time, less than 80% of my clients, I'd never met in person. I made a decision a long time ago that I didn't want to travel and do the traveling gig. I've always been able to go wherever I want and work wherever I want but for some reason it hadn't hit me until May 2020 when Luis and I were staring at each other saying, “We haven't seen a client in person in three months. We don't need to be here. Let's go.” Four weeks from now, we're hitting the road.

It's funny how so many people have realized that the more and more that you are used to working remotely or you realize what you can do from anywhere, it unlocks this potential. You can do so many things.

I like to think of it as the rest of the world's catching up finally with me.

Sales isn't something you do to somebody. It's something you do with them.

The rest of the world is crazy, you're not.

It was several years ago. At that time, I was consulting pretty traditionally, meaning I'd get on a plane and see people. Some events conspired in my life where I needed to be here and specifically there for my boys and what was going on in our life. I fired all my clients. I said, “I can't come work with anybody.” I didn't have any other clients. I didn't have any new ones to replace them but I let them know that I wouldn't be flying out anymore. I rebuilt my entire practice from scratch with all the things that needed to work for me. One of them, principally, was I'm not going anywhere.

You can create whatever you want to create. People seem to limit themselves when they put themselves in this place of like, “I can't do that.” You can do whatever you want.

That's one of the hardest things to grasp because it's a big world and I only need a dozen clients to have a phenomenal practice, so why not build that exactly as you want? Being a solopreneur or whatever we call it these days, is hard. It's grueling mentally and physically. At a minimum, wake up every day and be in the business that you love every aspect of it. If there's anything that you don't love about it, fix it, change it or do something different.

Let's get this party started. On the show, what we do is we dig into what's called flashpoints in people's stories, the moments in your life that have ignited your gifts to the world. In the process of doing this, what we're going to do is we're going to stop along the way and see what's coming up. You share what you're called to share and we'll give you the floor to do that. Townsend, take it away. You can start wherever you like. You can start from little Townsend.

I'm a little bit older, so that would take a long time. I usually start my story at the age of 27. That's always a fun place because I didn't have a real job until then. I worked in bike shops. I raced bicycles. I wanted to be a world-famous cyclist and that was a fun life for a while. I realized I wasn't going to be a famous cyclist. I simply don't have the genetics for it. For some reason, not long after my 27th birthday, this little bulb went on in my head that says, “You probably should go make some money.” Living on $14,400 a year is not a luxury lifestyle. If I want to do nice things or procreate or something that, I might need more. It had not occurred to me before then.

I'd always been involved in quasi-selling roles. I worked in bike shops selling bikes, worked for a bike manufacturer. I said, “I'll go do sales. I'm not qualified for anything else.” The path to get in sales then as now is pretty simple and that is you go find a crappy sales job. Back then, a crappy sales job was selling copiers back when such things were popular and even long distance. Some of the readers might not even know that long-distance used to cost money. Back in the day, businesses would pay per minute for long-distance and so are people. In the days of technology now, it’s like, “Pay for long-distance? That's crazy.”

I went to go work for this small reseller of long-distance out of Minneapolis. By an absolute universe and my own stupidity, I was able to leverage that role with a third-tier company that would have me to a real role with a national brand. AT&T hired me that I was able to go with three months of experience and sneak my way into the corporate world. It has always been a source of pride. From there, it was about a six-year run from bike shops and rolling burritos to a vice-president at a Fortune 500 company making 25X what I was making previously.

VCP 73 | Business Coach

That was a wild ride and fascinating. I woke up one day with a career-making more money than I'd ever imagined. Having this, what looked like on the outside an incredible life of prestige, power and being able to do whatever I want but the truth is I was miserable. I would wake up on a Sunday morning dreading Monday, not just later in the day. When that turned to Saturday afternoon, dreading Monday, that wasn't good. I decided I'm going to start my own company. I had this idea to start a company that was a sales consulting company. We would teach companies to sell. I was with Avaya at the time and doing a lot of internal development and training and coaching from a sales process and sales technique. I said, “I'll do this on my own.” I got some clients lined up and everything was great. I tendered my resignation. I got them to give me a 3 or 4-month severance window transition period.

As I was about to exit the company and get going, we rolled into March of 2002, which some may remember as when the world fell apart, the dot-com bubble. Every one of the clients that I had secured and told me that they were going to hire me, called me up and said, “We can't spend any money now.” I had a kid, a mortgage, a $250,000 a year lifestyle and no job. That was pretty interesting. What I reckoned was that if I couldn't get people to pay me to teach them how to sell, I could get them to pay me to sell for them. I had this idea of doing a sales outsourcing play. We'll sell for you. I'll build these sales teams. Lots of interesting stuff that went on in the next 6, 7 years.

I'll fast forward and say that the next time the world ended, which was right about 2009, the company that I built to several million dollars and 80 people working for me came crashing down. It was more of a soft landing because I saw what was happening. I was able to get everybody off the plane but in the course of six months, I shut down my company. I went bankrupt. I filed for divorce. Somewhere in there almost, I don't want to be dramatic and say almost died but certainly, it felt like I was dying from the stress and the pain of trying to grow and run a business. This puts us somewhere around 2009. That was a pretty tough time. That was a pretty devastating time and that everything in my life, personal, health, finances and business, all got scraped to the ground.

Retrospectively, I credit that tough, painful time with cracking something open. Some need or desire or suspicion that there's something more here to this whole life than just trying to accumulate money or fame or business. I can't remember who said it but there's a great expression, the tough thing about the rat race is no matter what place you're in, you're still a rat. The pain wasn't over. I went out and started consulting the way that most did, getting on a plane, these big fancy engagements, making a lot of money but I was wrecked at the end of them. I was still dealing with repercussions and fall out of the family coming apart, my kids were fairly young, both under eleven years old. Things were not going well.

That's when I had this wake-up call and said, “I need to create a life that works for me, not try and work to create a life.” I called all my clients up and said, “I don't know what I'm doing next but it's not flying out on Monday to come see you.” This was not a decision or something I did with money in the bank. Remember, I had scraped everything in the ground. This was a, “I don't know how I'm going to pay rent next month,” but I sat down and said, “What do I need to create so that this life works for me so that I can be there for my kids and pay my bills? How do I want to create that?” This was still much from a consulting standpoint but I got intentional about what do I want this life to look like, what the parameters are.

I took everything that I saw in the consulting world, from proposals to how people pay you to travel and said, “Here's what I'm going to do.” I decided I would never write another proposal again. I decided I would always be paid upfront. I decided I wouldn't get on a plane. I had a whole other list of requirements and set about finding clients that were willing to work with me under those conditions. For the next couple of years, that's what I did. I worked my ass off and served my ass off to focus on these founders and entrepreneurs and help them with their sales organization, sales motions and grow.

I appreciate it. These insights are helpful because I want to hear how you came to this place in your life. What I'm hearing is this element of seeing that there's more to life than what you're experiencing and seeing that there's an element of, you can't continue on this path. Coming to those realizations and seeing that you can do things differently in order to operate at a different level. That's what these moments are all about. Those flash points that we're talking about as going through moments in your life and you're saying like, “Something's got to give. I know that I'm not living the life that I'm intended to be living right now.”

It's interesting because you say realizations. To me, that's a pretty word. This was more the universe smashing my face into the concrete again and again until I got the lesson. It is how I think about it. The universe was quite relentless but I was able to listen. I did this consulting stuff and got good at it. I built an incredible successful practice and a practice that also fueled me and energize me. I didn't have a sense that anything else was missing but you think of flashpoints or moments in time that are significant. In October of 2014, I was working for my clients. I was in a conference room. I come in that day and there were a bunch of business cards. They're all the same scattered around.

You will not get where you want to with muscle however you try to find it. You got to start listening.

The CEO that I was serving was part of a CEO group. They met once a month and they always had a speaker come in. I picked up this card and the card had a red dot on the back. There’s stuff on the front but there's a dot in the back and that's what caught my attention. All the cards had a little dot but it wasn't in the same place. I'm like, “Is this a flipbook? What is this thing? Who puts a dot in the back of their card?” When I turned it over, it said, “Mike Valentine On Purpose Now,” some number and email. I asked the CEO, I said, “These cards, what's with the dot?”

He goes, “I don’t know.” You spent the day with this guy and you don't know what the dot is on his card? That's strange. His business is called On Purpose, my guess is there’s the intention here. I'm like, “I’m going to email this guy.” I emailed him. His name is Mike Valentine. He's one of my dearest friends to this day. I said, “I'm pretty sure a guy who puts a dot on the back of his card with a business called On Purpose has intention. I'm curious. The CEO couldn't tell me.” We ended up meeting for coffee not long after. I went to that meeting because I made it a practice always to try and see how we could help people, serve people. What showed up for me was I could probably help this guy from a sales standpoint because whatever he was trying to convey was missed when the CEO couldn't tell me what he did. I was going to help him out.

We sat down for coffee. We were three and a half minutes into the conversation when I said, “I'd like you to coach me.” What I thought was going to be me helping him was no, “I'd like you to coach me.” This was my first experience with a coach. I didn't even know what it meant. I was like, “I don't know what that looks like but whatever that word is, the words shown up for me is I need you to coach me.” That began an incredible journey for me over the last several years. I worked with Mike for a year. He does purpose work, connecting people with their purpose, the gifts they're here to give, the purpose they're here to live, their vision for the world and identifying that.

It wasn't too long after that. I was on a road trip with my wife Luisa. She had been insisting for some time that I read this book called The Prosperous Coach. I showed her that I didn't need any more books on coaching as I was a great coach and I've been doing this for years and I knew more than anyone in the world. We're on a road trip. I said I'd give her twenty minutes of the audible. I didn't tell her this at the time but I'm listening to it. For those of you have heard the audible, there’s Steve Chandler and there's Rich Litvin. I said, “That guy, you need to put them on 3X.” Steve Chandler because I can't deal with how slow he talks.

I said, “The British guy does 1.5X but I like him.” I decided, in that car, that guy is going to be my next coach. I didn't tell Luisa anything. My wife and I were talking, she said, “How's your day going?” I said, “It’s good.” She goes, “What do you get?” “I'm meeting with Rich Litvin today.” She goes, “Rich?” I said, “Yes. I’ll talk about him being my coach.” It was several years ago when I hired him and we worked together for about eighteen months. That was an incredible experience being part of his community. You probably see the theme in here, which is the personal development and inner work kicked it up multiple notches. Rich led me to Michael Neill, who Luisa and I flew to Singapore to work with and had an incredible experience at his Living a Guided Life Retreat.

We also participated in one in one and then I signed on to work with Steve Hardison out of Phoenix, which is a whole different level of commitment and intensity. It has been the most incredible wild ride in the last few years and diving into the deep end of the pool and then being able to take all that inner work and turn it around and serve my clients. One of the things that probably is important to note as a flashpoint is when I started working with Rich several years ago, he asked me a question. It was in our first session, he said, “Which of your clients inspire you?” I had a puzzled look and I said, “None of them. I think I'm the one that inspires them.” He said in his nice, subtle accent, “There’s no shame.” Something clicked for me. In that moment I decided two things. One, I'm going to have a practice full of clients that inspire me as much as I inspire them and I'm going to stop being a consultant who sneaks in coaching between the ears work and I'm going to be a coach.

I call it my coming out of the closet as a coach. That's where it got interesting because I thought, “I'm going to be a coach. I'm going to coach people and have coaching conversations. How do you feel? What do you want to be?” About three months into that, I was bored. What I discovered was I love playing this game with people who like to make money, who like to build companies, not because it matters but because it's a fun game. The unique way that I'm able to connect with folks and serve folks is in a lot of ways helping them go back to playing the game. Most of my clients are successful. They built the companies. They've been playing a game called make money their whole life, the problem is the games played them. They got to the point where another zero in their bank account or another house or home, it doesn't give many more juice.

What’s coming up for me is hearing this element of, it's the purpose that's ringing true. What's it for? Being able to bring together. This is what's so unique about you and I love it, is that your ability to bring the sales acting and the selling skills, which so many people run and hide from because they say to themselves, “Selling is creepy. I don't want to do that.” To own it and love that and then to love coaching, which comes from this place of the heart and then see it as a place that is like, “What's this all for?” The purpose and playing in the space of helping people to see that when I get to that exit, that I have a purpose at the end. There's a goal.

VCP 73 | Business Coach

Also, along the journey too. For years and years, my focus was, “Let's figure out the process, the structure, the tool, the technique, the playbooks, the scripts or whatever that will get the results.” What was fascinating to me, Tony, was how much work that took to get people to adopt and change techniques that were better. When I stopped focusing on the outside and started focusing on the inside, both sides, “What are you playing for,” to whoever I'm coaching and helping them see the value and power of understanding what their prospect is playing for. Sales isn’t something you do to somebody, it's something you do with them. It's a way you serve them. Should you be talking about your product? Hell no. Should you be talking about features and benefits? You can but what people care about is what you're going to do for them. They need to be connected with that whether I'm talking about the sales process, coaching somebody or selling something for one of my clients.

On a sales conversation or coaching on a sales call, it's all the same conversation, which is, “So what? If we do this and we do that and you get this then what? Who cares?” I have my company. I've got a great episode where I was coaching an individual and he was talking about selling his company, I was like, “Now you're there and you've sold it, what do you got?” The best he could come up with was, “I'll go on a cruise.” I'm like, “You're playing for going on a cruise. That doesn't inspire me, much less you.” When he started looking, what he found was there were some pretty powerful, incredible sources of inspiration he already had access to. He just wasn't thinking about him. He was thinking about it as, “I'll get to that someday.” A lot of my work is helping people take someday and bring it into today and see how that fuels here. It's fun.

It's connecting to that. You and I play a similar game, it's about inspiration. It's finding what inspires you and you being inspired by the people and getting them to be inspired by their future and bringing their future, pulling it into the present right now.

My mission statement these days is simple. I work with inspiring people to help them make a ton of money, have a massive impact in the world and be ridiculously happy. It's the confluence of those things. If you only want one of those, you'll need to find another coach. What's been fun is playing with this concept of inspiration because when I first heard what Rich shared with me and said, “I want inspiring clients?” What I interpreted that is I'll sit there with my checklist and make sure you meet the criteria. That's not a fun game to play to be realistic or honest, most people aren't living at a high level of inspiration. They're just getting through the day.

What showed up over time was there are two kinds of people I'm going to work with. Those that show up with this incredibly inspiring mission and I haven't had one of those yet or the people that come there with some kernel of inspiration and a desire to play a bigger game. People come to me and say, “I want to work with you.” I say, “What's your vision?” They go, “Blah.” I go, “I got the good news and I got the bad news. The bad news is that's not good. That's not inspiring. It doesn't meet my level. The good news is I'll help you build something bigger and then we'll talk about working together.” We usually spend a couple of conversations, which are not an engagement, it’s just conversations, seeing if we can create a bigger game to play. If we can then it's cool. Let's work together to go after this game. That's been fun because it's not serving those that are on an inspiring mission. It's helping raise the level of overall inspiration in the world, by helping people access that.

It made me think of this concept of when people show up for a coaching session in general, sometimes the problem's not the problem. The underlying problem is the people aren't dreaming enough about what they want.

What you mean to say is the problem shows up but is never the problem, not even close. They're not dreaming big enough. It's not their fault, they've been trained not to. Nobody raises their kids and says, “Come on little Johnny or Susie, what do you want?” They say, “The slowdown and it's not to get out in front of your headlights so you won't be disappointed. Be reasonable. Be realistic.” That's not what I do.

I want to shift gears a little bit. There's been a lot that you've learned along the way. I feel like in some ways because your energy level is always in this positive and uplifting place, I want to get down and dirty around the hard lessons that you've learned. Before we wrap, I want to make sure people know the Townsend's laws for living.

Failure is part of the process.

The hard lessons. I don't know if this is the hardest lesson to learn but it took a long time to get to a place of acceptance that a lot less of this and how things turn out is up to me. I spent a lot of years coming at this whole game, all the parts of my game with, “What do I need to do? Here's what I need to do. Here's what's going to happen because of me.” Good news is it gets you pretty far. Force of will, work ethic, which I've always had and smarts, you can get far. The problem is that takes an incredible amount of energy. However many energy units it takes you to get to money, rich, what you realize quickly is, “If I want to double my impact, I'm going to have to double that pain.”

That's pretty sobering when you're sitting there running the engine into the red and RPM and relying on sheer force of will. That was the hardest lesson to learn, is you are not going to get where you want to get with muscle however you wanted to find it. You got to start listening. You have to listen to the universe. You have to trust, listen, surrender, all the things that for people who have a track record creative accomplishment is hard because the ego has a fantastic business case that I am here because of all that I've done. That sounds cool until you realize the flip side, which is, “I got to keep doing it as hard as I've been doing it or I'm going to lose it all.” That sucks.

It’s not sustainable.

Even if you could sustain it through some Herculean effort, you can't keep going up. Nobody wants to stay where they're at whether it’s money or reach or impact, we want to be growing and expanding. That's how we're wired. When we're not going and expanding, that becomes incredibly painful for us yet, if growth and expansion only has one formula, which is more work, more stress and more sacrifice, that runs out of rope. That's a pretty important one, is you're going to have to find a different energy source here. You're going to have to find a different set of tools. Every single one of my clients is dealing with the same phenomenon, which is what got them here is not going to get them anywhere further. They're miserable where they are, not quite miserable but they're getting there.

That was a tough lesson. A lesson that nobody can hear enough is that failure is part of the process. It's so funny to me because we hear this as almost as a mantra, “Failure is good. Failure is learning.” As soon as we're away from the guy on stage talking to us, we beat ourselves up for failure. It's one of these things that everybody can pair it but people don't put into practice. I share with folks that failure is part of the process. I don't know if it was so much a lesson, it was a way of describing something that's always been fairly intuitive to me, that is that life gives you perfect feedback. You may not be listening, you may not like it but whatever is going on is perfect feedback.

The universe does make mistakes. The hard part of that lesson is when you're in the middle of hell and you've got a strong opinion that you shouldn't be here, whatever your opinion is, the universe doesn't care. The universe is trying to show you something. If you can back off from your own resentment, anger, pity, blame, judgment and go, “What's happening here? What am I being shown?” You can move incredibly fast. Michael Neill has a great way of framing it. He talks about life as a game of hot and cold. We so desperately want to have feedback and know what the right answer is going to be, what the right path is going to be. It doesn't work that way. Like hot and cold, the kids’ game, you take a step and you get feedback. If you're standing there trying to decide which way to take a step, you get no feedback. The universe gives perfect feedback and that feedback will only come after action. After taking a step, you must take an action to receive the feedback. Whether you like it or not, it will be perfect feedback.

I love the way you put it because I don't think I've heard that concept of perfect feedback but it's a nice way of thinking about it because I 100% agree that the concept is so cool.

Life gave me perfect feedback several years ago when it took my finances, marriage and health down to zero. I was being shown something I needed to see. I was unhappy about it at the time, Tony. I thought it was unfair and I thought I deserved better. What was interesting is 2021 was my first full year of all of my relationships will be coaching clients. I left behind a big practice of consulting to be a coach. My decision was I will still do consulting but not unless I'm also coaching the founder, the leaders or what have you. I'm not just going to do consulting. I woke up in January of 2021 with no clients. January was rough, part of February was too. Fortunately, I was a lot better now than I was several years ago and going, “What am I being shown here? My conversations are not generating clients. What is the universe telling me? This isn't working. It's not wrong. It's not bad. There are no mistakes here. What am I need to hear?”

VCP 73 | Business Coach

I was then able to see clearly where I wasn't listening and what I needed to do to get things moving. That's tough. It takes a lot of trust. This whole concept of listening to your inner wisdom, following the voice of the universe, the voice of God, consciousness, sounds great in theory but it requires two things. One, it requires hearing that sound, which means you got to turn down a lot of the other noise. The second is you got to trust it. There's a wonderful little story of the guy that's hiking on the cliff and falls. He slides down the edge and manages to grasp a branch on the end, tenuous grip but he hasn't died. It’s hundreds of feet below. He starts yelling and screaming saying, “Somebody help me up there. I'm falling. I need help up.”

Screaming for a little bit, all of a sudden he hears a voice, he goes, “This is God. I got your back. No worries. You're safe. I'll take care of you.” “God, Thank you so much. Tell me what to do. I'll do anything.” He goes, “Let go.” “Sorry. Say what? I'm not sure I caught you there. I'm slipping here. Can we hurry this up?” “Go ahead and let go. I got you. Everything will be okay.” To which he goes, “Is there anybody else up there?” We don't always like the answer that the universe gives us. We want a better answer. We want the answer we're going to like right now. It doesn't always show up that way. Most oftentimes, the powerful messages show up with a good dose of pain and discomfort. It’s to make sure we’re listening.

There are so many things that we've touched on that. There are such great insights that people who are reading are going to be like, “This is something that I could apply right now.” I want to shift gears a little bit into something that's unrelated but it's something powerful nonetheless. What is one book or some books that have impacted you along your journey?

It's a funny topic for me because I've always been a voracious reader but I go on these weird cycles. Back when I was starting my corporate world, I read everything that I could get my hands on. What I saw is this fact that there are only three business books written and they're all variations of that, so I stopped reading all these business books. I came back to it. A couple of years ago, I went through it. It was all this stuff I started with Mike. There were 2 or 3 books that I read a dozen times. One was Perfect Brilliant Stillness by David Carse, not even in print anymore. You can find it online in a PDF version. It is a journey into essentially non-duality and it's one man's journey. This guy has a fascinating story. He had an enlightened experience, spent years integrating, wrote one book because everybody was bugging him too and then went back to doing carpentry and nobody's ever heard from him again.

He's like, “I don't exist. That's fine with me.” That led me to a gentleman by the name of Ramesh Balsekar. He's got a lot of great books but one of my favorites is Confusion No More and then Let Life Flow. If I was going to say one Balsekar book, it would be Let Life Flow. I read those obsessively. I would get to the end and start over again. Every time I read them, something else will pop out. There's so much great stuff there. Anything by Michael Neill, The Inside-Out Revolution is a phenomenal one. If people are interested, there's a way to configure this. I have a document that I've created. I call it Book Clusters because I had this concept that there are books that go together in different categories.

I've got a book cluster on happiness and peace, enlightenment, security and safety, persuasion negotiation and humanity. We're talking a hundred books here that are clustered around, “If you read these 3 or 4, you would have an incredible insight into this stuff, mindset, creativity and innovative thinking.” I usually read 3 or 4 books at a time. The good news is I am back to reading. I go through these reading droughts. I'm reading a fascinating book right now that is called Moonwalking with Einstein: The Art and Science of Remembering Everything. I finished Upstream. If you want a more tangible business book, Upstream by Dan Heath. I read The Alchemist at least once a year and I read The Four Agreements at least once a year, most of the time two. Those are some of my staples.

To answer your question, first of all, all those books you mentioned are powerful books, especially I love the titles of the ones that I had never heard of, which I'm going to need to check those out. I don't know where to go from here. It was so amazing that you came on the show and shared all of your insights and your story. Powerful stuff. Not that I was ever surprised by that. It's such a pleasure to have you.

Thanks, Tony. This was a lot of fun.

Life always gives you perfect feedback.

It was good to have you on the show. I also wanted to give people some way to know how to get in touch with you or where they can find you.

Probably my website is best, It's a one-page website. There are some links there. I post a lot of content to Instagram. It's @TownsendWardlaw. I do short videos there every couple of days. I also do writing on Medium. I've got a Medium channel. There's not a whole lot of Townsend Wardlaws, so that's a good thing. If you do a Google search, you’ll find a lot of stuff. I've got a YouTube channel that I mostly remember to put the videos up as well. It's fascinating because a lot of people know me as a sales consultant. I don't talk about sales anymore because I've said it all already and it's already been said by others. There are so many great sales consultants that I spend most of my time not talking about, what goes on between the years and mindset and happiness and peace and how do you enjoy this ride on the way to wherever you get.

I'm looking forward to sharing this with everyone. I can't thank you enough for coming to the show. I want to thank the readers for coming on the journey with us. This has been fantastic. Thank you.

Thanks. I had a lot of fun.


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